The only way this would be ok is if openai was actually open. make the entire damn thing free and open source, and most of the complaints will go away.
over it is then. Buh bye!
Why does Sam have such a punchable face?
all billionaires do
let’s have a tier list of billionaires by face punchability.
my top 3:
#1 Elon Musk
#2 Mark Zuckerberg
#3 Jeff Bezos
Yeah but his especially, it’s so squishy.
Cosmic justice?
Business that stole everyone’s information to train a model complains that businesses can steal information to train models.
Yeah I’ll pour one out for folks who promised to open-source their model and then backed out the moment the money appeared… Wankers.
Perhaps this is just a problem with the way the model works. Always requiring new data and unable to use current data, to ponder and expand upon while making new connections about ideas that influenced the author… LLM’s are a smoke and mirrors show, not a real intelligence.
yeah thats crazy
But I can’t pirate copyrighted materials to “train” my own real intelligence.
Now you get why we were all told to hate AI. It’s a patriot act for copywrite and IP laws. We should be able too. But that isn’t where our discussions were steered was it
Man, what if we abolished copyright, but also banned gen AI completely. I think that would be the funniest answer.
It’s copyright, not copywrite—you know, the right to copy. Copywriting is what ad people do. And what does this have to do with the PATRIOT Act?
True!
you can, however, go to your local library and read any book ever written for free
Unless it’s deemed a “bad” one by your local klanned karenhood and removed from the library for being tOo WoKe
klanned karenhood
Yoink
i almost wrote that caveat, but decided to leave it low hanging….
as far as i know, though, that only applies to children’s books at this point…
any book ever written
Damn! Which library are you going to?!
F in chat for the library of Alexandria.
if the library doesn’t have a book, they will order it from another library….
every american library…What if it’s out of print?
Mine doesn’t…
are you sure? have you actually tried? or maybe ask a librarian?
most public libraries are part of a network of libraries… and a lot of their services aren’t immediately obvious….
also, all libraries have computers and free internet access…
i’d like to ask what library in particular, but you probably don’t want to dox yourself like that….My city library will pull from nearby libraries for a fee (like $2/work I think?), or I can use my card at those same libraries for free (just need to return to the same library), but AFAIK they don’t pull from anything beyond that. We’re a relatively small city (like 30-40k people), so maybe things are different downtown.
University libraries, however, will pull from pretty much everywhere, and they have access to a ton of online academic resources.
So can the AI
Copyrights should have never been extended longer than 5 years in the first place, either remove draconian copyright laws or outlaw LLM style models using copyrighted material, corpos can’t have both.
I think copyright lasting 20 years or so is not unreasonable in our current society. I’d obviously love to live in a society where we could get away with lower. As a compromise, I’d like to see compulsory licensing applied to all written work. (E.g., after n years, anyone can use it if they pay royalties and you can’t stop them; the amount of royalties gradually decreases until it’s in the public domain.)
Bro, what? Some books take more than 5 years to write and you want their authors to only have authorship of it for 5 years? Wtf. I have published books that are a dozen years old and I’m in my mid-30s. This is an insane take.
The one I thought was a good compromise was 14 years, with the option to file again for a single renewal for a second 14 years. That was the basic system in the US for quite a while, and it has the benefit of being a good fit for the human life span–it means that the stuff that was popular with our parents when we were kids, i.e. the cultural milieu in which we were raised, would be public domain by the time we were adults, and we’d be free to remix it and revisit it. It also covers the vast majority of the sales lifetime of a work, and makes preservation and archiving more generally feasible.
5 years may be an overcorrection, but I think very limited terms like that are closer to the right solution than our current system is.
Exactly! That’s what we had originally in the US, and I thought that was more than fair. I would add that the renewal should only be awarded if they can prove they need more time to recoup R&D costs and it’s still available commercially.
So yeah, something in the neighborhood of 10-15 years w/ a renewal sounds totally fair to me. Let them keep the trademarks and whatnot as long as they’re in use (e.g. you shouldn’t be able to make a new entry in a series w/o the author’s permission for the marks, but fanfic that explicitly mentions it’s not original/canon would probably fall under fair use), but the actual copyright should expire very quickly.
You don’t have to stop selling when a book becomes public domain, publishers and authors sell public domain/commons books frequently, it’s just you won’t have a monopoly on the contents after the copyright expires.
how about: tiered copy rights?
after 5 years, you lose some copyright but not all?it’s a tricky one but impoverished people should still be able to access culture…
What does that even mean though? Like, you would retain the ability to sell and modify it but not a monopoly on free distribution?
I think 10-15 years, i.e. the original copyright act in the US (14 years) is totally fair, and allow a one-time renewal if you can prove it’s still available for purchase and losing copyright would impact your livelihood or something.
i left it open ended like that because there’s a lot of options….
i’d probably start with selling, like after 5 years people are welcome to copy it and distribute it but not sell it…
but i mean, a lot of variations are possible….
We’ll just having some copyright look like?
Probably allowing everything but producing reproductions.
Basically they could use the ideas from the book and whatnot to do whatever. But they couldn’t just print duplicates with a different cover and sell them for cheaper.
And how do you think that’s going to go when suddenly the creator needs to compete with massive corps?
The reason copyright exists is for the same reason patents do: to protect the little guy.
Just because corporations abuse it doesn’t mean we throw it out.
It shouldn’t be long, but it sure should be longer than 5 years.
Or maybe 5 years unless it’s an individual.
Oh so like the music industry where every artist retains full rights to their work and the only 3 big publishers definitely don’t force them to sell all their rights leaving musicians with basically nothing but touring revenue? Protecting the little guy like that you mean?
Or maybe protecting the little guy like how 5 tech companies own all the key patents required for networking, 3d graphics, and digital audio? And how those same companies control social media so if you are any kind of artist you are forced to hustle nonstop on their platforms for any hope if reaching an audience with your work? I’m sure all those YouTube creators feel very protected.
The original 14-year duration w/ an optional renewal is pretty fair IMO. That’s long enough that the work has likely lost popularity, but not so long that it’s irrelevant. Renewals should be approved based on need (i.e. I’m currently living off the royalties).
The current copyright term in the US is utterly atrocious.
Oh, we should also consider copyright null and void once it’s no longer available commercially for a “reasonable” price. As in, if I can’t go buy the book or movie today for a similar price to the original launch (or less), then you should lose copyright protections.
The reason copyright exists is for the same reason patents do: to protect the little guy.
If you actually believe this is still true, I’ve got a bridge to sell ya’.
This hasn’t been true since the '70s, at the latest.
I agree that copyright is far too long, but at 5 years there’s hardly incentive to produce. You could write a novel and have it only starting to get popular after 5 years.
You don’t have to stop selling when it becomes public domain, people sell books, movies, music, etc that are all in the public domain and people choose it over free versions all the time because of convenience, patroning arts, etc.
Hard to compete with the megacorp that publishes all books on a 5 year delay and rebrands it as their own, because there’s no rules with public domain.
Well, except trademark and fraud. But there are plenty of workarounds to that.
Thanks that’s very insightful and I’ll amend my position to 15 years 5 may be just a little zealous. 100 year US copyrights have been choking innovation due to things like Disney led trade group lobbyists, 15 years would be a huge boost to many creators being able to leverage more IPs and advancements being held in limbo unused or poorly used by corpo entities.
I think 5 years is a bit short.
the issue is that foreign companies aren’t subject to US copyright law, so if we hobble US AI companies, our country loses the AI war
I get that AI seems unfair, but there isn’t really a way to prevent AI scraping (domestic and foreign) aside from removing all public content on the internet
“We can’t succeed without breaking the law. We can’t succeed without operating unethically.”
I’m so sick of this bullshit. They pretend to love a free market until it’s not in their favor and then they ask us to bend over backwards for them.
Too many people think they’re superior. Which is ironic, because they’re also the ones asking for handouts and rule bending. If you were superior, you wouldn’t need all the unethical things that you’re asking for.
Sounds like you are describing the orange baboon in the white house.
these kinds of asshats are all the same. Only difference is the size of the hat.
Good.
Fuck Sam Altman’s greed. Pay the fucking artists you’re robbing.
If I’m using “AI” to generate subtitles for the “community” is ok if i have a large “datastore” of “licensable media” stored locally to work off of right?
It’s so wild how laws just have no idea what to do with you if you just add one layer of proxy. “Nooo I’m not stealing and plagerizing, it’s the AI doing it!”
So pirating full works for commercial use suddenly is “fair use”, or what? Lets see what e.g. Disney says about this.
What if we had taken the billions of dollars invested in AI and invested that into public education instead?
Imagine the return on investment of the information being used to train actual humans who can reason and don’t lie 60% of the time instead of using it to train a computer that is useless more than it is useful.
But you have to pay humans, and give them bathroom breaks, and allow them time off work to spend with their loved ones. Where’s the profit in that? Surely it’s more clever and efficient to shovel time and money into replacing something that will never be able to practically develop beyond current human understanding. After all, we’re living in the golden age of humanity and history has ended! No new knowledge will ever be made so let’s just make machines that regurgitate our infallible and complete knowledge.
Where are the copyright lawsuits by Nintendo and Disney when you need them lol
