• poor leftists talk about poverty, labor aristocrats get uncomfortable and insist that sociological classes aren’t materialist. “all that matters is that we’re working class - we’re all in this together”

  • black leftists talk about racism, whites get uncomfortable and insist that they’re not personally part of the problem. “we mustn’t allow the bourgeois to divide the proletariat along racial lines - we’re all in this together”

  • female leftists talk about patriarchy, men get uncomfortable and insist that it hurts them too. “this men vs women stuff is reductive anyway - we’re all in this together”

  • third world leftists talk about imperialism, americoids get uncomfortable and insist that red white and blue lives matter too. “what happened to the international working class - we’re all in this together”

you don’t have to invite yourself to every form and experience of oppression. anyone with a baby’s consciousness of intersectionality ought to be capable of admitting when they have privilege

    • Mardoniush [she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
      40·
      1 year ago

      Yeah, one of my critiques of LA/PMO conceptions of tech workers having different class interests or being a new class is that…well…their aristocracy isn’t. It’s extremely conditional and the Bourgoisie has an interest in removing it. It’s all false consciousness boosted by a larger paycheck.

      On the other hand dismissing the real poverty of the lower ranks of the working classes is also a real problem. Wealthy workers have a responsibility to contribute more to the left, not whine about how they’re also poor struggling exploited proletarians

            • redballooon@lemm.eeEnglish
              2·
              1 year ago

              By saying labor aristocracy is still just workers, and implying everyone is on the same boat?

              • Othello [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
                32·
                1 year ago

                youre being obtuse. the issue is saying “we’re all workers” in order to dismiss peoples valid concerns and experiences. Obviously tech workers are still workers. their workers just privileged has hell, and they generally need to learn when to shut up and listen.

                • redballooon@lemm.eeEnglish
                  2·
                  1 year ago

                  Is that the issue? Because when I consider myself in the same boat as poorly paid workers, it’s to support their — and my — rights, benefits and security.

                • redballooon@lemm.eeEnglish
                  2·
                  1 year ago

                  Maybe differentiate between poverty and workers rights?

                  I’m in a good job and have no idea about living in poverty. Without my job and state support I would last some months, maybe a year. Long Covid could take me out easily. I am privileged by having a good job, but when head’s comes to tail I am in the same boat as any other workers.

                  Honestly I don’t really understand what OP is trying to say.

                  • iie [they/them, he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
                    12·
                    1 year ago

                    the main point is that leftists belonging to privileged groups are not immune to chauvinism, bigotry, and unexamined privileged thinking, and when someone criticizes them for it their response should be to shut the fuck up and listen instead of getting defensive or accusing them of dividing the left.

                  • RNAi [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
                    5·
                    1 year ago

                    I didn’t get the first point cuz labor aristrocracy by definition is not pretending to be on the left, nor talking to the poor proles, and a lot nor even considering themselves “a prole”. Plus most have the oppprtunity to become petty burshwá.

                  • NoLeftLeftWhereILive@hexbear.netEnglish
                    4·
                    1 year ago

                    No but if you have a boat that keeps you afloat for a year and especially if you know it, you have a lot more room to manouver than someone like me whose boat would instantly sink. It gives you more space even before anything happens to you so the difference is there all the time.

                    It’s like saying falling from a cliff has the same result regardless of how high it is. We are both on a cliff, but it’s not the same one.

                    The thing about poverty is that there are no error margins on anything. It strips you of good choices and ends up forcing you to make expensive and oppressive choices in ways that is impossible to explain to someone who has never been poor, and that is how we are different.

          • pillow [she/her]@hexbear.netOPEnglish
            10·
            1 year ago

            ur getting it nicholson-yes

            I used to argue with pmc urbanist types and the conversation always went something like:

            me: “true it’s inconvenient to have to walk far to the subway station but if u build a new station here then property values will shoot up and hundreds of poor ppl will be evicted. idc about the tech workers”

            them: “I hate gentrification discourse. you can’t just hold back progress for the sake of a minority of people. are you going to deliberately sabotage the city so that better off workers don’t want to live there?”

            struggling against ppl like that can be a matter of life and death for the poor. any day of the week they’ll throw us under the bus for the sake of their own stratum’s restaurant selection. if we show solidarity to them they either won’t notice or shrug and find it completely natural bc it comports with their own priorities. but they will never support us in return unless they already see it as in their interest. that’s how the real world works. where does that leave @UlyssesT@hexbear.net’s vague feel-good notion of solidarity?